Series 2a 109 6 cylinder restoration

[haveyoubooked]

.....I'd be inclined myself to keep the body and paint just as it is!...

Save the removal of someone's quest to walk up the vertical panels, me too. Looks great. Leave as.

A good friend with a Series 2a 88 said the same thing - leave it as is. The big dents in the o/s/f wing bug me and the rust on the tailgate frame...my concern is if I repair those, it will be hard to stop! The doors and rest of the panels aren't to bad, just a couple of little frame repairs to make on the lower doors and a bit on lower a pillars.

Out of interest is the air vent grille on o/s/f wing normal on a very late 2a/6 cylinder thingor is that an addition/changed wing do you think?

[jkhackney]

A few moments of Land Rover peace while the ham, beans and potatoes are in the oven and the family's watching National Lampoon ...

I also like the look of yours. A tailgate and catflap would be nice to have.

My six (in the heavy Dormobile) doesn't accelerate the vehicle quickly but what's nice is that you don't have to downshift it up a hill. It just keeps chugging. I guess I don't really need 1st gear except on really steep hills or with a heavy trailer.

I have rebuilt the engine except for a rebore/pistons though this is due. The prices you found for spares are what's to be expected. Take better care of it than the previous owners and it'll not have to be rebuilt ever again.

Especially oil changes. I found my filter housing lacked a spring that my S3 sixpot had, which presses the paper filter element home onto an internal seal and separates the "in" and "out" flows. Maybe my previous owner lost it? I found an appropriate spring and modified my 2A to be like the 3 I had had.

Take care of the head as these can crack. I presume it's caused by overheating? Mine was cracked when I got it. Avoid a lean fuel mixture and retarded timing (or too advanced / pinking).  In my experience the valve seats are hardened but the exhaust valves can take a battering and so I use a lead replacement. Also take care of the exhaust manifold as these are hard to find and expensive.

An "H" suffix, do you have the all-synchro gearbox (very short throw 1st gear selection)?

In 2020 I put my refueling records into a spreadsheet and came up with 15.9MPG Imperial over 25330 miles in 12.2 years. The type and conditions of driving was very variable. Little fixes like replacing the spark wires and plugs on time or the setting of the fuel float level in the carb (Stromberg on mine), or the bigger fix of a new timing chain and tensioner make a big difference in fuel economy and power. On long journeys I can average 18, short trips in the cold it can be 12 or worse. Cardboard over the grille helps it run better in the cold.

I check the valve clearance about every oil change. You get fast at it. Keep cork seals and Hylomar in stock. I also check the ignition timing at least twice a year.

It burns oil that comes by the inlet valve seals (especially on descents with engine braking when the oil gathers at the front of the engine/ #1 cylinder). They all do that, even the Rover cars. Well-adjusted valve clearance or using the foot brake rather than a low gear on descents can reduce this. But I also burn oil from my smooth bores: about a quart of oil per 1000 miles.

Yes my European/British block /normal compression 2.6L was green (grey inside). Not the same as the 2.25 color though.

OK now back to Christmas with the Griswolds!
Jeremy

[22900013A]

Welcome, nice to see another six pot owner. I remember your vehicle being for sale as someone asked if it was ex southern electric, I said no as they didn't operate in Scotland!
I see you asked about parabolics, be aware there are some excellent standard spec springs out there and parabolics often make the vehicle looked "jacked" in an odd way.

Looking forward to your progress. Here is my 69 six cylinder 1-Ton.

That looks very smart! Nice to see it in use, not many 1 tonnes about. I love the 1-Ton wheels but think the price of them will keep them further down my list!

I bought mine off a lad called Terry Kemp who had it up on Facebook, he's a local magpie for Landies. Mine was registered new in Aberdeen and has spent its last 40 years at least within 15 miles of me - first in Ardross at an engineering firm, then up on a croft out at Croick. I'm hoping to get in touch with PO's eventually.

To be honest prices have dropped significantly since the 8x16 rims appeared from Nakatenga.

[haveyoubooked]

A few moments of Land Rover peace while the ham, beans and potatoes are in the oven and the family's watching National Lampoon ...

I also like the look of yours. A tailgate and catflap would be nice to have.

My six (in the heavy Dormobile) doesn't accelerate the vehicle quickly but what's nice is that you don't have to downshift it up a hill. It just keeps chugging. I guess I don't really need 1st gear except on really steep hills or with a heavy trailer.

I have rebuilt the engine except for a rebore/pistons though this is due. The prices you found for spares are what's to be expected. Take better care of it than the previous owners and it'll not have to be rebuilt ever again.

Especially oil changes. I found my filter housing lacked a spring that my S3 sixpot had, which presses the paper filter element home onto an internal seal and separates the "in" and "out" flows. Maybe my previous owner lost it? I found an appropriate spring and modified my 2A to be like the 3 I had had.

Take care of the head as these can crack. I presume it's caused by overheating? Mine was cracked when I got it. Avoid a lean fuel mixture and retarded timing (or too advanced / pinking).  In my experience the valve seats are hardened but the exhaust valves can take a battering and so I use a lead replacement. Also take care of the exhaust manifold as these are hard to find and expensive.

An "H" suffix, do you have the all-synchro gearbox (very short throw 1st gear selection)?

In 2020 I put my refueling records into a spreadsheet and came up with 15.9MPG Imperial over 25330 miles in 12.2 years. The type and conditions of driving was very variable. Little fixes like replacing the spark wires and plugs on time or the setting of the fuel float level in the carb (Stromberg on mine), or the bigger fix of a new timing chain and tensioner make a big difference in fuel economy and power. On long journeys I can average 18, short trips in the cold it can be 12 or worse. Cardboard over the grille helps it run better in the cold.

I check the valve clearance about every oil change. You get fast at it. Keep cork seals and Hylomar in stock. I also check the ignition timing at least twice a year.

It burns oil that comes by the inlet valve seals (especially on descents with engine braking when the oil gathers at the front of the engine/ #1 cylinder). They all do that, even the Rover cars. Well-adjusted valve clearance or using the foot brake rather than a low gear on descents can reduce this. But I also burn oil from my smooth bores: about a quart of oil per 1000 miles.

Yes my European/British block /normal compression 2.6L was green (grey inside). Not the same as the 2.25 color though.

OK now back to Christmas with the Griswolds!
Jeremy

Will make sure I check the spring - I did change the oil filter when I got it unseized and I'm fairly sure there was one in there.

Thats some good data with regards fuel economy - lots of miles there, and what I was hoping for. Hoping to get near 20 on longer flat runs with the O/D and expecting 12 ish when fully loaded on short runs. Most runs in the highlands are 30 miles plus though.

Good to know what to expect with normal oil consumption levels too.

Will plan to check the valve clearances every 3000 miles then (seem to think that's what the book recommends). That'll be every 3 months ish which isn't too bad. Will change exhaust manifold studs out in head to ensure its not going to be too much of a pain.

I think I have the all synchro gearbox. I've only had it very slowly into 2nd on the road as im fairly sure it will snap in half if I hit anything much bigger than a pebble at those speeds on the current chassis). It was 15 years since I drove a series 2 so can't really remember the length of throw accurately enough to compare it to this one. From what I read it should be all synchro - can check out the g/box serial number when it comes out, and I'll be replacing all bearings and seals plus any worn parts as a matter of course in there anyway so will find out then regardless.

[haveyoubooked]

Welcome, nice to see another six pot owner. I remember your vehicle being for sale as someone asked if it was ex southern electric, I said no as they didn't operate in Scotland!
I see you asked about parabolics, be aware there are some excellent standard spec springs out there and parabolics often make the vehicle looked "jacked" in an odd way.

Looking forward to your progress. Here is my 69 six cylinder 1-Ton.

That looks very smart! Nice to see it in use, not many 1 tonnes about. I love the 1-Ton wheels but think the price of them will keep them further down my list!

I bought mine off a lad called Terry Kemp who had it up on Facebook, he's a local magpie for Landies. Mine was registered new in Aberdeen and has spent its last 40 years at least within 15 miles of me - first in Ardross at an engineering firm, then up on a croft out at Croick. I'm hoping to get in touch with PO's eventually.

To be honest prices have dropped significantly since the 8x16 rims appeared from Nakatenga.

Never even heard of Nakatenga before. Just checked them out, they look great and price is good. Much appreciated. Effect on fuel economy? At 12000 miles a year I can take a couple of MPG either way but more might limit them to winter only/offroad use.

[22900013A]

Welcome, nice to see another six pot owner. I remember your vehicle being for sale as someone asked if it was ex southern electric, I said no as they didn't operate in Scotland!
I see you asked about parabolics, be aware there are some excellent standard spec springs out there and parabolics often make the vehicle looked "jacked" in an odd way.

Looking forward to your progress. Here is my 69 six cylinder 1-Ton.

That looks very smart! Nice to see it in use, not many 1 tonnes about. I love the 1-Ton wheels but think the price of them will keep them further down my list!

I bought mine off a lad called Terry Kemp who had it up on Facebook, he's a local magpie for Landies. Mine was registered new in Aberdeen and has spent its last 40 years at least within 15 miles of me - first in Ardross at an engineering firm, then up on a croft out at Croick. I'm hoping to get in touch with PO's eventually.

To be honest prices have dropped significantly since the 8x16 rims appeared from Nakatenga.

Never even heard of Nakatenga before. Just checked them out, they look great and price is good. Much appreciated. Effect on fuel economy? At 12000 miles a year I can take a couple of MPG either way but more might limit them to winter only/offroad use.

I very much doubt wheel width would have any impact on fuel economy. Tyre pattern and width would.

[NoBeardNoTopKnot]

.... leave it as is. The big dents in the o/s/f wing bug me and the rust on the tailgate frame...my concern is if I repair those, it will be hard to stop! The doors and rest of the panels aren'

For me, rust on the tailgate is part of its 'thing'. Untouched 109s are getting rare, don't mess this one.  If you touch it, you'll be forced to do the rest. Dinks in wings, leave as, or take the worst out, such that repairs  look 'able barnyard' over 'perfect panel-beater' and have the inner confidence to stop right there.

Make it top-notch underneath, eat your dinner off it, anywhere not seen. Feel free to disagree, yet for me a minter Series has its sartorial equiv. in the bloke covered in brand names - smacks of... well... you can try too hard.

[haveyoubooked]

.... leave it as is. The big dents in the o/s/f wing bug me and the rust on the tailgate frame...my concern is if I repair those, it will be hard to stop! The doors and rest of the panels aren'

For me, rust on the tailgate is part of its 'thing'. Untouched 109s are getting rare, don't mess this one.  If you touch it, you'll be forced to do the rest. Dinks in wings, leave as, or take the worst out, such that repairs  look 'able barnyard' over 'perfect panel-beater' and have the inner confidence to stop right there.

Make it top-notch underneath, eat your dinner off it, anywhere not seen. Feel free to disagree, yet for me a minter Series has its sartorial equiv. in the bloke covered in brand names - smacks of... well... you can try too hard.

I'd like to have the ability to stop myself getting the panel beating hammer and DA out...we'll see! I think you're right, if its super clean underneath, in the cab and inner tub and under bonnet, then it will look right with weathered exterior. Original paint is making me veer towards keeping it. Need to decide how far to go in terms of replacing lights/trims/re-galving cappings etc. Will be taking new chassis to black as I'm not a fan of seeing the galv coating, and the state my 3 year old galv Ifor trailer is in after regular use for just three years makes me think the galv won't be in good shape for that long on these super salty roads.

End result needs to be respectable as it'll be the daily for our business, and we're lining up an old sign writer to hand paint the livery onto it.

[Old80]

Very nice, in my opinion the 109" full hardtop is the ultimate Land Rover for functionality. I agree with others about keeping the vehicles scars, it's what makes the vehicle unique, although I would straighten out that bumper, the rest I would leave well alone.
Good luck with the rebuild.

[haveyoubooked]

Very nice, in my opinion the 109" full hardtop is the ultimate Land Rover for functionality. I agree with others about keeping the vehicles scars, it's what makes the vehicle unique, although I would straighten out that bumper, the rest I would leave well alone.
Good luck with the rebuild.

Thanks for that - Thats actually one of the bits i'm looking for s/h as I think I'll struggle to get the crease out of it. Does anyone have a straight s/h bumper that they'd sell?

[NoBeardNoTopKnot]

...my opinion the 109" full hardtop is the ultimate Land Rover for functionality....

Agreed. I think I'm correct in saying more 109s were made, and for just that reason. Somehow, because  few of today's owners,   'own to use',  88s are the survivors. They get called 'a workhorse' and 'heavy-duty'. None of which you'd say if used.

Bumper: Yes, if not barnyardable, it must go, few would not draw the line at crash-damage. Have the courage to leave be. Super clean underneath is the way, you can fake new, you can't fake 'real'.

[Calum]

It burns oil that comes by the inlet valve seals (especially on descents with engine braking when the oil gathers at the front of the engine/ #1 cylinder). They all do that, even the Rover cars. Well-adjusted valve clearance or using the foot brake rather than a low gear on descents can reduce this. But I also burn oil from my smooth bores: about a quart of oil per 1000 miles.

When I last had the head off my 2.6 I considered drilling or milling a passage in the web in the head to allow oil to drain down the pushrod tubes. Partly due to the oil consumption but also because I tend to do the valve clearances with it parked on my drive and the oil goes everywhere when I remove the rocker cover. Earlier IOE 6 cylinder engines used the pushrod tubes as a drain before they added the return gallery in the block casting (all LR engines use the later casting). The sensible side of me wants to drill the hole but the other side of me says Rover changed it for a reason (and put up with the oil burning issues?)

[haveyoubooked]

It burns oil that comes by the inlet valve seals (especially on descents with engine braking when the oil gathers at the front of the engine/ #1 cylinder). They all do that, even the Rover cars. Well-adjusted valve clearance or using the foot brake rather than a low gear on descents can reduce this. But I also burn oil from my smooth bores: about a quart of oil per 1000 miles.

When I last had the head off my 2.6 I considered drilling or milling a passage in the web in the head to allow oil to drain down the pushrod tubes. Partly due to the oil consumption but also because I tend to do the valve clearances with it parked on my drive and the oil goes everywhere when I remove the rocker cover. Earlier IOE 6 cylinder engines used the pushrod tubes as a drain before they added the return gallery in the block casting (all LR engines use the later casting). The sensible side of me wants to drill the hole but the other side of me says Rover changed it for a reason (and put up with the oil burning issues?)

That's interesting Callum, so that's the hole in the centre of the o ring. TBH it's a strange one, the block is set up to take a drain, drilled for draining oil but the head isn't, and doesn't seem equipped to shift the oil fast enough. I seem to remember something about type a and type b heads on the p4 forum. Type a heads had no web and no drain at the rear so all oil drained down pushrod tubes. Type B head had web down middle to keep oil from draining down pushrod tubes and a drain at the rear.

On my 6 i can't recall if it has the web (stops oil going down pushrod tubes) but it definitely has an undrilled rear drain on the head, despite the block having provision for it...so assuming no web, as the oil must drain down the tubes.

I've been offered a rover 110 engine which I'm tempted to accept as it has a type b head with twin SUs, not to run as a daily but to see what difference the extra 20 or so BHP makes and keep as a spare for if my head is requiring maintenance in future

[Calum]

It burns oil that comes by the inlet valve seals (especially on descents with engine braking when the oil gathers at the front of the engine/ #1 cylinder). They all do that, even the Rover cars. Well-adjusted valve clearance or using the foot brake rather than a low gear on descents can reduce this. But I also burn oil from my smooth bores: about a quart of oil per 1000 miles.

When I last had the head off my 2.6 I considered drilling or milling a passage in the web in the head to allow oil to drain down the pushrod tubes. Partly due to the oil consumption but also because I tend to do the valve clearances with it parked on my drive and the oil goes everywhere when I remove the rocker cover. Earlier IOE 6 cylinder engines used the pushrod tubes as a drain before they added the return gallery in the block casting (all LR engines use the later casting). The sensible side of me wants to drill the hole but the other side of me says Rover changed it for a reason (and put up with the oil burning issues?)

That's interesting Callum, so that's the hole in the centre of the o ring. TBH it's a strange one, the block is set up to take a drain, drilled for draining oil but the head isn't, and doesn't seem equipped to shift the oil fast enough. I seem to remember something about type a and type b heads on the p4 forum. Type a heads had no web and no drain at the rear so all oil drained down pushrod tubes. Type B head had web down middle to keep oil from draining down pushrod tubes and a drain at the rear.

On my 6 i can't recall if it has the web (stops oil going down pushrod tubes) but it definitely has an undrilled rear drain on the head, despite the block having provision for it...so assuming no web, as the oil must drain down the tubes.

I've been offered a rover 110 engine which I'm tempted to accept as it has a type b head with twin SUs, not to run as a daily but to see what difference the extra 20 or so BHP makes and keep as a spare for if my head is requiring maintenance in future

I should have clarified - my 2.6 has a weslake head (type B) fitted, which is designed to drain through the gallery at the back of the head. The normal euro-spec LR engine has what was the Rover 95 head and is designed to drain through the push rod galleries. I've no idea what caused them to change their minds. I would think any way to aid 'spent' oil getting back to the sump would be a good thing.

If your 110 engine has twin carbs it probably isn't a 110 engine (or at least a weslake head). The only 6 cylinder engines to have twin carbs as standard were the 105S and the earlier 75 (2.1 litre I think?)

[haveyoubooked]

It burns oil that comes by the inlet valve seals (especially on descents with engine braking when the oil gathers at the front of the engine/ #1 cylinder). They all do that, even the Rover cars. Well-adjusted valve clearance or using the foot brake rather than a low gear on descents can reduce this. But I also burn oil from my smooth bores: about a quart of oil per 1000 miles.

When I last had the head off my 2.6 I considered drilling or milling a passage in the web in the head to allow oil to drain down the pushrod tubes. Partly due to the oil consumption but also because I tend to do the valve clearances with it parked on my drive and the oil goes everywhere when I remove the rocker cover. Earlier IOE 6 cylinder engines used the pushrod tubes as a drain before they added the return gallery in the block casting (all LR engines use the later casting). The sensible side of me wants to drill the hole but the other side of me says Rover changed it for a reason (and put up with the oil burning issues?)

That's interesting Callum, so that's the hole in the centre of the o ring. TBH it's a strange one, the block is set up to take a drain, drilled for draining oil but the head isn't, and doesn't seem equipped to shift the oil fast enough. I seem to remember something about type a and type b heads on the p4 forum. Type a heads had no web and no drain at the rear so all oil drained down pushrod tubes. Type B head had web down middle to keep oil from draining down pushrod tubes and a drain at the rear.

On my 6 i can't recall if it has the web (stops oil going down pushrod tubes) but it definitely has an undrilled rear drain on the head, despite the block having provision for it...so assuming no web, as the oil must drain down the tubes.

I've been offered a rover 110 engine which I'm tempted to accept as it has a type b head with twin SUs, not to run as a daily but to see what difference the extra 20 or so BHP makes and keep as a spare for if my head is requiring maintenance in future

I should have clarified - my 2.6 has a weslake head (type B) fitted, which is designed to drain through the gallery at the back of the head. The normal euro-spec LR engine has what was the Rover 95 head and is designed to drain through the push rod galleries. I've no idea what caused them to change their minds. I would think any way to aid 'spent' oil getting back to the sump would be a good thing.

If your 110 engine has twin carbs it probably isn't a 110 engine (or at least a weslake head). The only 6 cylinder engines to have twin carbs as standard were the 105S and the earlier 75 (2.1 litre I think?)

Ah, i didn't realise. Owner of the engine who i've known a few years through village life and has a P4 himself bought it as a spare from Dounreay, described it as a 110 but he got it home and found its seized. So he's punting it on for £200 complete with all ancillaries. It sort of seems worth it for the parts, looks pretty good externally, lots of dust from sitting rather than covered in corrosion, so thought i might be able to harvest spare internals too.