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[Ian F]

I'm a bit baffled.  Were these certificates used as legal documents for identification of the vehicles?  I always assumed your version of a vehicle title -  'vehicle registration document' - was issued by the government/county.  Ours are registered by the State the vehicle is in. 

I did note this on the '£6.00 for one question' - "Please note, this information is provided by email and will not be accepted by registration authorities. If you require a formal document you will need to purchase a Heritage Certificate."

Correus, if I am understanding your puzzlement correctly:

The legal document in the UK is the V5c, the official logbook which identifies the registered keeper (who is not necessarily the owner)

The Heritage certificate is provided by British Motor Heritage (a charity I believe?). It is an extract from the industry records but has no legal status as far as I know.

Others may contribute here, but I hope that helps.

Ian F

[Larry S.]

If you have a vehicle already in the "system" - with a registration document - not a problem.

The problem arises when someone finds an old vehicle (Land Rover, tractor, sports car, etc.) in a barn that has not been registered, or registered many years ago, but now has "lost`' the registration number and the owner wishes to transfer ownership and or get it registered with a new number plate or MoT'd.
Same applies to an import.

No paperwork, no proof of date of manufacture - you are now stuffed.
The vehicle needs to be inspected to beside it is authentic.
This our club can do (for a fee).

  We do not inspect a box of bits.
The vehicle has to be complete, but necessarily running or in a roadworthy condition.
It has to be complete.

You have no idea of the things people used to try and get away with.
They still do.
There's a lot of Series 2s out there with Defender parts, on coil springs and the like 
The only thing being the cab plate. There was one on here recently.
These owners are evading road tax and MoT safety checks and therefore they are not insured if taken on the road 

Thanks. That makes sense, not a whole lot different than around here.  There are many things people try to pull around here as well. 

I had Grover for two months and three weeks before I could legally drive him on the street.  The broker sent the wrong title with him and once I got the correct title the number was wrong, the last two numbers were transposed.  It took almost two months to fix it.

[Peter Holden]

My MGB GT was manufactured in 1977 but first registered in 1978. In 2017 I sent a Heritage certificate to DVLA to get their records amended to 1977 as date of manufacture. No problems then.

The Heritage Certificate can be used for corroboration but not as primary evidence when registering a vehicle under the V55/5 scheme for "first regiistration of a used vehicle.

The reasons are :
1  You supply the initial information to the Heritage Centre - You can get the certificate for any land rover that you know the chassis number or VIN for.  The Heritage Centre dont ask for proof of your title to the vehicle.
2.  Using parchment paper any halfway competent computer user could produce a fake.

Peter

[Larry S.]

Correus, if I am understanding your puzzlement correctly:

The legal document in the UK is the V5c, the official logbook which identifies the registered keeper (who is not necessarily the owner)

The Heritage certificate is provided by British Motor Heritage (a charity I believe?). It is an extract from the industry records but has no legal status as far as I know.

Others may contribute here, but I hope that helps.

Ian F

Interesting.  Thanks.

The following doesn't make much sense though - "The legal document in the UK is the V5c, the official logbook which identifies the registered keeper (who is not necessarily the owner)".  Can you give me an example of this?  Would this be something along the lines of a company, or fleet, vehicle?

[Ian F]

As far as I understand, the only proof of ownership is a receipt signed by the previous owner, for the funds provided to transfer the vehicle to your ownership.
My V5 c clearly states:
"this document is not proof of ownership"

Ian F

[Peter Holden]

That is my understanding also.

Peter

[TimV]

Forgot to mention the reason for the question - rather vain actually.

Grover is turning 60 this year, but I have no clue when.  He is an early one, somewhere between January 1 and whatever date in March they switched from lowercase suffix letters to uppercase. 

Due to the shipping issues I don't want to take the chance of extended delays and missing the date.  The way my luck has been going I'd probably get the certificate weeks after the build date and miss the day.

If that is all you want - you can get it by email, and not incur the extra charge. I only wanted the dealer dispatched to - a small charge. The certificate looks good on the wall - but that's it.

[Larry S.]

If that is all you want - you can get it by email, and not incur the extra charge. I only wanted the dealer dispatched to - a small charge. The certificate looks good on the wall - but that's it.

True.  And from what Wittsend said, a person may end up with a certificate  missing some of the information.

[Wittsend]

If you look at the pic of my certificate ^^^
(Story it's too big for the screen)
Scroll down and you'll see a lot of blank spaces.
This is because Land Rover never recorded that info and the certificate format the Motor Museum use is a generic template suitable foe all makes of car in the '50s & '60s.

Genem has also posted that the Museum can get the details wrong 


 

[Larry S.]

If you look at the pic of my certificate ^^^
(Story it's too big for the screen)
Scroll down and you'll see a lot of blank spaces.
This is because Land Rover never recorded that info and the certificate format the Motor Museum use is a generic template suitable foe all makes of car in the '50s & '60s.

Genem has also posted that the Museum can get the details wrong 


 

Yup, I noticed that. 

I'm really glad I asked about this.  I've been on the fence about ordering a certificate for several years - didn't care for the cost, but it would be unique to hang on the wall.  Now that I know about the other option, and the possibility of missing, or wrong, info I think I'll skip the certificate, for now anyway.

On top of that... I've been told Grover's 'origin story' and it's rather interesting; don't know if I want the certificate to burst that bubble!!  Plausible deniability type thing - if the truth doesn't match the story I could no longer tell it!!  LOL

[Larry S.]

Man... really glad I brought this up and a special thanks to Exile! 

From memory I think I paid £6.00 for one item of information by email.

I went ahead and a made my request and just got a response about 10 minutes ago.  Grover is a January baby - born on a Thursday, January 17, 1963! 

Considering all that is going on I don't think that a certificate would of made it to me before January 17th.  I purchased two different WWI photographs from two different people in Britain over a month ago and there is still no sign of them.

[Wittsend]

At least you can have the birthday party now and crack a bottle of champagne over the bonnet 

 

[Larry S.]

At least you can have the birthday party now and crack a bottle of champagne over the bonnet 

 

Definitely!  Hopefully the champagne won't freeze!!

[GHOBHW]

another january land rover, mine was born on the 7th of january 1964 and despatched on the 29th

mail in britain is slow enough at the moment, so i bet its even slower going to the USA

[Larry S.]

another january land rover, mine was born on the 7th of january 1964 and despatched on the 29th

mail in britain is slow enough at the moment, so i bet its even slower going to the USA

Cool...  guess I'll find out the dispatch day when I get the certificate.