Quote from: NoBeardNoTopKnot on Today at 02:27 PMI think we mix 'popularity then or now' with sales figures. Except in the first year or so of production, buyers bought rather more 109s than 88s.
You had to have a need for an 88, and not everyone had that, 88s are not as practical, they bought more 109s.

88s were LESS popular with buyers.

However as 88s & 109s progressed thru' the food-chain it is the 88 that better survives. Hence popular now.

According to Gaydon records, 88" IIas took up over 57% of the UK Land Rover market, with petrol 88" models being by far the most common type sold (41.6% of all UK sales).

Quote from: simonbav on Today at 03:44 PMHas anyone experience using these or similar hole punch/joggler? Rated up to .8mm stainless material

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/135021624857?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=zrlcd_jdthi&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=Fxm85MKLRNC&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

Well spotted sir

I was looking at the Dunsfold collections Rolls powered 81" the other day and only then realised it was the rear axle that got moved back. Not quite sure why, I didn't climb under it to investigate. Maybe it was purely to allow a longer propshaft?

https://www.dunsfoldcollection.co.uk/collection/series1/81-rolls-engined-military-trials#v

Craig.

Quote from: w3526602 on Yesterday at 05:35 AMHi,

 
If you want a rare SWB, seek out an 81"!

I believe they made 200 ... half with a Rover Engine, half with the Rolls Royce engine from the Champ ... for Army "suitability" trials ... interchangeability of spares, etc.

I can't remember why they decided they didn't want the Champ. 

602 (Who contrived to squeeze a BMC 2.2TD into a Champ ... about 50 years ago ... and found it was cheaper to run than Barbara's Hillman Imp, but only because diesel cost a lot less than petrol per gallon)

The 81" always had the Rolls Royce engine, there was no need or purpose in extending the wheelbase by 1", it was done solely to accommodate the much bigger engine.

You are correct there was never a 109" series 1 station wagon, as it was never offered with a diesel engine. The series 1 lwb utility chassis is quite unlike the station wagon chassis. They were not commonised until the series II appeared.

Many more lwb were built than swb, some export markets not even offering the 88". Few have survived as they were usually workhorses, and less desired meant often worth more as parts donors for an 88". The home market was more balanced, but it was mainly utility and military orders filling the 109" order books, with private buyers preferring the 88".

Haven't tried them but got to be worth a go at that price.

The similar ones from Frosts that I have are now £79!

Craig.

The genuine series one parts manual I have is printed in the early 60's so it is referred to as the "land Rover series one" on the front cover. Before the series two's were released they were off course simply Land Rovers.

That manual does mention all the differences between the the 86" and 88" models and covers the 2 litre Diesel engine which is very recognisable as the basis for the series 2, 2286 engines.

As you say, the 86" series one became an 88" simply by moving the spring hangers, spring bushes, and damper mountings 2" forward on the same chassis. The front grille panel was moved forward only 1" however so the front crossmember moved 1" as well. I think the inner wings were different, bonnet length, outer wings, steering link rod between the box and relay, and the front propshaft was longer.

As you also correctly say, the 107" station wagon never got the Diesel engine so it never became a 109" station wagon, at least not until the series two came along.

The series one 107" utility and station wagon chassis are very different things however. For the 107" (and 109") utility chassis, imagine an 86" chassis cut in half behind the gearbox after the chassis steps upwards, with really long rear rails stuck to it.
Off course that wouldn't work for the 107" station wagon as the rear floor needs to go in the space behind the gearbox but before the chassis steps upwards so they made a very unique chassis for the station wagon.
The 107 (and 109") utility also had the rear springs under the chassis rails, the station wagons were placed outside the chassis rails and it was off course the station wagon design they standardised on for all the 109" series two models.

Even the series two 109" chassis frames vary though from the station wagon to the utility models. It is essentially the same thing but not interchangeable without cutting floor supports and mounting brackets off and replacing them with specific ones for the model you are building.

Craig.

Has anyone experience using these or similar hole punch/joggler? Rated up to .8mm stainless material

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/135021624857?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=zrlcd_jdthi&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=Fxm85MKLRNC&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

Hi.

It was only relatively recently that I read that the 86" and 88" used the same basic chassis rails, with the extra 2" being found by moving the front axle foreward. Similarly, the 107" and 109".

Rovers never mentioned the change to the Plus 2 (My description), and very few people noticed. For those that did notice, all became clear when they introduced the diesel engine which initially was two litres.

I've known for a long time that the Series One LWB ESTATE was never changed to 109". I presume that was because the LWB estate was never supplied with a diesel engine.

Did the Parts Book reflect that there had been changes?

602

More photos here:

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?vanity&set=a.900395429983623

Looking again at your photo I can't see the bonnet side catches I'd expect to see, although the only possible ex-Sweb one I know of didn't have them either. Unfortunately the photo is too dark for me to really get a sense of the tyre size, and most of the wheels are cropped out. It might be one but I'm not 100% certain.

Looking from home on the PC - the vehicle does appear to be a IIA going by the door hinge, but they look like 7.50x16 tyres to me.